Hi Guys,

I am trying to find some ancestors of my father.

According to Thru lines, William Bailey (b1811) married a Mary Booth, daughter of Joseph Booth and Sarah Wilkenson in 1852 in Sheffield. Rather than just using this data, I always cross check it but I cant find any record of any Mary (of any surname just in case she was a widow) marrying a William Bailey.

Thanks for any help you can give

regards

Steven

Hi Steven,

From our marriages found under Parish Records.

BAILEY, William (Bachelor, age ~, ~, residing at Parish of Rotherham).
Married Mary BOOTH, on August 12, 1816, by ~ (Banns) at
Parish Church, Rotherham. Father's name is ~ (~).

Is this the one you are looking for?


Elaine in Ottawa.

Instant Messenger: Skype

According to Free BMD there is no such marriage registered anywhere in England and Wales between 1850 and 1856.
Dave

Hi Steven, Perhaps the record you found is wrong. There is a William Bailey marrying Mary Kent 5 August 1829 Rotherham, There is a record of them living in Brightside which would explain the Rotherham marriage. They where both born around 1807-1809.

Steven
According to FMP there was a Mary Booth, daughter of Joseph Booth and Mary born in Keighley in 1810, and a Joseph Booth had married MARY WILKINSON in Keighley in 1809.
Coincidentally a Mary Booth married a Joseph Sharp(e) BAILEY in 1831 , also in Keighley.
Could this be what you are looking for?

The edit function is not working!!!!!
CORRECTION. Mary Booths mother was SARAH not Mary and Joseph Booth married SARAH Wilkinson. All in Keighley
Dave

Yes thankyou, that is the one that is being put to me as the marriage in the thrulines tree. Does FMP give a reference for it or is it just part of an online family tree?. Thanks again

Thanks Elain.

It looks like it, the problem is that according to the census data, William was born in 1911 and Mary in 1811. Getting married at 5 would have been pushing it even for those times. Any chance of a mis transcription for the date.

Also can I ask, would a person born in Sheffield be getting married at Rotherham?. In all the census's they were living in Harvest Lane Brightside or Brightside Bierlow.

Tanks for all the help

Thanks Dave, I found that as well. 1852 also seems very late given thier ages

Thanks Barry

There is every chance it could be wrong, Thrulines harvests information from other peoples trees and I don't trust other people (to many people peeing into the Fountain of Geneological Knowledge) and that is why I always want to see the original record.

That would tie into the birth of their first son George born 1832 in Sheffield. Can you explain the link between Brightside and Rotherham, my google shows them being 4.5 miles apart. Was Rotterham the parish church?.

Thanks again

Just thinking on it Barry,

Could Mary Kent have been a widow?.

Perhaps there was a marriage between a Mary Booth and a Mr Kent somewhere.

Can you tell me where you got the record below from.

thanks Steven

Hi Steven, The marriage is on this site. KENT, Mary (Spinster, age ~, ~, residing at parish of Rotherham).
Married William BAILEY, on August 5, 1829, by ~ (Banns) at
Parish Church, Rotherham. If she lived in Rotherham it would be where they married possibly.

Hi Steven, Can you share the information you have on George 1832?

George Bailey SOn of William and Mary Bailey

Born 1832
Sister Mary born 1834
Brother Joseph born 1838

All in Sheffield

Married Sarah Hellewell in 1850

13 children

Is thus the information you are seeking.

This is the tree information:


Birth
1832 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
5 Sources
1832

(AGE)

Birth of sister Mary Bailey(1834–)
1834 • Yorkshire, England
1834

2

Birth of brother Joseph Bailey(1837–)
1837 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1837

5

Birth of brother Joseph Bailey(1837–)
1838 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1838

6

Residence
1841 • Harvest Lane, Brightside, Yorkshire, England
1 Source
1841

9

Marriage
1850 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
Event Type: Marriage Registration District: Sheffield Name: Sarah Hellewell Marriage Date: 1850 Marriage Place: Sheffield, Yorkshire, England Volume: 22 Affiliate Line Number: 26 Registration Quarter: Oct-Nov-Dec Registration Year:

Sarah Hellewell
(1835–)

1850

18

Birth of daughter Mary A Bailey(1851–)
1851 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1851

19

Occupation
1851 • Ecclesall Bierlow, Yorkshire, England
Brace Bit Fitter

1 Source
1851

19

Residence
1851 • Rock Lane, Ct 6, Ecclesall Bierlow, Yorkshire England
1 Source
1851

19

Birth of son George A Bailey(1852–)
1852 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1852

20

Birth of son Joseph Bailey(1856–)
1856 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1856

24

Birth of son William Henry Bailey(1858–)
1858 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1858

26

Birth of daughter Clara Bailey(1860–)
1860 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1860

28

Birth of son Walter Bailey(1861–)
1861 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1861

29

Occupation
1861 • 25 Cliff Street, Ecclesall Bierlow, Yorkshire, England
Joiners Tool Maker

1 Source
1861

29

Residence
1861 • 25 Cliff Street, Ecclesall Bierlow, Yorkshire, England
1 Source
1861

29

Birth of son John Bailey(1863–)
1863 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1863

31

Birth of son Albert Bailey(1864–)
1864 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1864

32

Birth of son Edward Bailey(1866–)
1866 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1866

34

Birth of daughter Elizabeth Bailey(1868–)
1868 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1868

36

Birth of son Ernest Bailey(1870–)
1870 • Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
1870

38

Occupation
1871 • Bradleys House, Brightside Bierlow, Sheffield, England
Brace Bit FIler

1 Source
1871

39

Residence
1871 • Bradleys House, Brightside Bierlow, Sheffield, England
1 Source
1871

39

Birth of daughter Ada Bailey(1878–)
1878 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
1878

46

Birth of daughter Mary Ann Bailey(1881–)
1881 • Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
1881

49

Edit
Occupation
1881 • Sheffield Yorkshire England
Brace Bit Filer (Tool)

1 Source
1881

49

Residence
1881 • Court 2 , 20 Harvest Lane, Brightside Bierlow

This shoots down the theory of her being a widow lol...

Thanks Mate

Hi Steven,

Just a quick update.

Rotherham was the place where large numbers of Sheffielder's marriages took place. Many of my Upper Hallam kin were married there.

We have tried to guess many times on the FORUM why this would be.

Less High Church than Sheffield Cathedral.
The sheer numbers that were married at the Cathedral especially prior to 1848 where all marriages were supposed to take place.
I have also heard that the time frame for marriages were restricted.

At least you have the right couple.

Interested in the Sarah Helliwell you listed especially if she came from Bradfield. I will be off line for a few days so may not reply straight away if you post anything.

Elaine in Ottawa.

Instant Messenger: Skype

Steven, the marriage in 1850 of Sarah Hellewell is to George Bailey, not William.
Also do you really believe that Sarah married in 1850 at the age of 15?
Dave

Hi Dave

Thanks for response

Yes, I am aware of George marrying Sarah Helliwell, sorry if it wasn't clear in my post. George is the line I am following and I am trying to find his mother, Williams's wife.

I am sure that Sarah is Georges's wife, in the 1851 census George 19 is living with his inlaws, his 16-year-old wife, and 2-month old daughter.

Class: HO107; Piece: 2342; Folio: 242; Page: 65; GSU roll: 87598-87600
Name Age
Benj Helliwell 42
Eliz Helliwell 37
Wm Helliwell 17
Sar Bailey 16
Hart Helliwell 13
Jno Helliwell 11
Eliz Helliwell 8
Hy Helliwell 4
Geo Bailey 19
M A Bailey 2 Mo

I suspect (and maybe doing a disservice), that there may have been a bit of a shotgun wedding to this. Lol

there is no new sn under the son, no mistake we can make that our ancestors haven't done before

Williams children do not appear to have been christened anywhere, How sure are you about the Booth connection?

I am not sure of the Booth connection, it was given me by thrulines and I don't trust it. Thats the reason for this post. But the Kent one is looking more and more likely simply because its all we have

Steven
A glimmer of hope for you. According to GRO INdex: in Sheffield there is both birth and death in Q1 1845 of Elizabeth BAILEY. Her mother maiden name is KENT.
If your Mary was Mary Kent then the Birth cert or the death cert for Elizabeth should have confirmation for you. They are both available as pdfs (£7 each) with email delivery in about a week.
Dave

PS In fact Elizabeth was very short lived, both the birth and death are registered in the first few days of January 1845.

Thanks, Dave

You have earned your cape and red underpants.

That fits well within the time frame as the last child known was born in 1837 and only three children is a fairly small number for those times.

(I read an article once about the spread of syphilis and it said it was quite common to find families that started out strong with children and then had a series of deaths of children or deafness. Not sure if it was the truth or not.)


Can I ask which GRO you are using, I use freebmd and it does not have maiden names. Does it also have the birth of Joseph Bailey born 1837 with a mother Kent?.

Thanks,

I will order those certificates. One brick wall down and another two created. Family Historians know nuclear physics well.

Steven, The GRO Index is on the same government site where you order certificates. You need to sign up to that site but it is free. IT COVERS BIRTHS AND DEATHS STARTING IN July 1837 so I assume Joseph was born before that. Only Elizabeth born 1845 satisfies the criteria of Bailey, mmn Kent in Sheffield in the period July 1837 to 1860.
Note that Mary Bailey nee Kent would be 37/38 in 1845, so quite risky for a healthy birth in those days.
The easiest way to order is to search the index to find the record, select the record, choose the option PDFFormat then your order form will come up correctly filled in.
Please let us know what you find on the certificates.
Dave

Edit note there is no mmn on the death cert which was in the same Q1 1845 so technically it is an assumption that it is the same child. However both registrations were in the first few days of January (calculated from Free BMD) making it pretty certain.

Ages at the time of marriage.

In 1754, Hardwicke's Marriage Act, decreed that parties under the age of 21 (minors) required the consent of parents or guardians to marry. But it was not until 1763 that the minimum age of marriage was fixed at 16. Prior to this date, the church accepted the marriage of girls aged 12 or more and boys aged 14 or more.

I believe that folks could be married earlier with the consent of parents. BUT I wonder how closely this was carried out.

Just needs a little Googling.

Elaine in Ottawa.

Instant Messenger: Skype

Thanks for this. I have used the site before but they have changed it since I last used it. Then you had to supply the details and there was no search feature. It's a pity the search function is not a bit more flexible, only allowing a 2-year span is restrictive but it's still a great tool. Well done finding Elizabeth. I will order the certificates and let you know what they say.

Cheers and thanks again

Steven

Hi Guys

I got the GRO certificates back and you are right.

Mary Kent is the mother.