I am searching for the marriage record of Michael Burke and Cecilia Magovern. I found the christening record for their son, John, in St.Vincent of Paul, Sheffield, York, England on June 14, 1857 so I am guessing that their marriage took place there probably not long before 1857 since John seems to have been their only child. By the 1861 census Cecilia is listed as a widow.

Thanks in advance for any help anyone can give,
Carol

Name Michael Burke
Sex Male
Age 23
Residence Place Lambert St
Birth Year (Estimated) 1828
Father's Name Thomas Burke
Father's Sex Male
Spouse's Name Sida McGowin
Spouse's Sex Female
Spouse's Age 20
Spouse's Residence Place Lambert St
Spouse's Birth Year (Estimated) 1831
Spouse's Father's Name John McGowin
Spouse's Father's Sex Male
Marriage Date 25 Dec 1851
Marriage Place Cathedral Church of St Peter and St Paul Sheffield, Sheffield, Yorkshire

Wow! Thank you!
Best regards,
Carol

It looks like SIDA is a transcription error. Looking at the original record on FMP I believe her name is written as SILLA.
It is also noteworthy that the marriage was one of 31 all performed by the same incumbent on the same day.
Dave

Evening Guys,

I still read it as Sida. I think its the "M" as in McGowin that you are reading as the double L. I could be wrong Old eyes etc. LOL. BUT Silla would make sense....

I have just had a look at the 1861 census.

Cicely Burke is aged 35 born Sheffield.
I can't see her on our 1841 census index.

On the marriage cert it states she is 20 years old in 1851.

GRO.

BURKE, JOHN MCGORVERN
GRO Reference: 1857 J Quarter in SHEFFIELD Volume 09C Page 287

Elaine.

Cecilia McGowan is on the 1851 census at 6 Welch's Court, Hawley Croft. She is 25, born Ireland and sister of the head of household Martin McGowan (37). All 12 people in the household were born in Ireland. It is clear from the ages and place of birth of Martin's children that he and his wife and children left Ireland no earlier than 1844.
Also in the household is a boarder, 28 yr old Mary McGowan (John's godmother at the 1857 baptism?).
Dave

Thank you again. I will make note of all of this. I am trying to connect the dots between the John Burke who married Annie Hague 27/10/1878 in Sheffield (and gave birth to several children some of whom have ancestors who are DNA matches to me) to the Micheal Burke who is listed as his father on his marriage certificate.

Just adding the marriage of Michael & Sida/Cilla where her age is listed as 20 years.

MCGOWIN, Sida (Spinster, age 20, ~, residing at Lambert St).
Married Michael BURKE, on December 25, 1851, by Edwd S Murphy (Banns) at
Sheffield Parish Church, Church Street, Sheffield. Father's name is John McGowin (Labourer).
Married in the presence of Patrick Connelley (mark),Mary McGowin (mark).
Notes: Bride and Groom signed with a mark.

The other unusual happening is the birth of John in 1857 after the 1851 marriage.

Elaine in Ottawa.

Hi Carol,
I think I have found a promising death for Michael Burke, given that he probably died between 1856 and 1861.
In 1861 Cecilia (Cicely) Burke(widow) and infant son John are living with Thomas Magown (B:1821) and his family at White Croft Sheffield.
MICHAEL BURKE died: 2nd May 1858 age 49 (B abt 1809) at White Croft. Occupation: Labourer
Buried at: Sheffield General Cemetery, 4th May/1858
Grave No. 214 (?) Number of burial,8002

This record can be found on Family Search website.

HAPPY HUNTING:sleuth_or_spy:

This family is not what it seems at first sight.

In 1861 Cecilia is a widow (35) and with son John B 1857 in Sheffield
1871 The two are still together in Sheffield but Cecilia (still BURKE) is a WIFE (AGE 45, b Ireland)) but there is no husband present. She is a HAWKER
1878 Son John marries in Sheffield to Annie Hague. He declares his father as Michael Burke, SEAMAN
1881 John and Annie now have 2 daughters, Mary Cecilia b 1879 and Sarah Ann b 1880 ( both Sheffield) and John's mother CiCILY is with them (AGE 59) in Newcastle Street. She is a HAWKER born Ireland. Her marital status is unclear.
The 2 baby daughters died in Q2 1881 in Newcastle Street Sheffield. They were buried 3 days apart at St Michaels Rivelin (see our burials over to the left)

1891 John and Annie are in Monk Wearmouth, SUNDERLAND with 3 more children, Mary Ellen b Sheffield q1 1882, Charley b Sheffield (Registered as Tom Charles q1 1886) and Annie b SUNDERLAND registered Q2 1889 as Anne. All have MMN Hague
!n 1891 there is in London (West Ham) a 71 yr old Cecilia Burke, SINGLE, a Servant, born Ireland. Is this her?

John and Annie had a further 4 children, John (b 1892 Sunderland Died 1897 Sheffield, Norah, b 1895, Sheffield died 1896 Sheffield, Frederick b 1897 Sheffield and Harry b 1900 Sheffield
John (junior) and Norah are buried in the same grave at Sheffield City Road (RC Ground) and in there with them is their grandmother Cecilia Burke (widow) who died in 1899 age 78 at St Elizabeths Home.
The various births and deaths can be found on GRO Index and the burials (Sheff City Road and St Michaels) are in our Burials over to the left.

Dave

Thanks again for the additional information. Maybe that is the death record for Michael although I am thinking he should not have been in his 40's in 1858 but keeping record of exact birth dates doesn't seem to have been a universal practice back then from what I have seen.

I knew about the two girls that died young, Cecily and Sarah Ann, but didn't know John and Ann had so many others that also did not survive.

I am in contact with one of my DNA matches who is the ancestor of one of John and Ann's children and she will also be interested to learn all of this.


Carol

Carol
On the 1851 Census there is a Michael Burke, General Domestic Servant age 20 at 36 WEST BAR. He was born in Ireland.
At the 1851 marriage to Silla, Michael is said to be 23 and both parties give address LAMBERT STREET, which is off WEST BAR. One witness was Patrick Connelley.
At the 1851 census there is a Patrick Connolly in LAMBERT STREET, a Tailor and boarder age 21 born Ireland.
He marries at Sheff Parish Church in 1852, age 24, Tailor and both parties give PEA CROFT as their address. These 3 addresses are within a few yards of each other.
These must be the correct Michael Burke and Patrick Connolly.

There is something not right about the ages of Michael and Silla at their marriage, We know that she was actually 25(that is consistent with the censuses 1851,61 and 71).
Lying about her age is not unusual, but why would she say she was underage?, therefore inviting consent issues. If she was going to understate her age she would say 21 at the lowest.

I suspect that the incumbent, who was so busy doing 31 marriages on that Christmas Day, has, when he transferred his notes to the register mixed up the two ages, ie Michael was 20 and Silla was 23 (a white lie).

What happened to Michael? I suspect he abandoned her and absconded. Maybe he did go to sea.
On closer inspection of the 1871 Census it is clear that Cicely is said to be 59 and MARRIED.
So we have for Cecilia
1851 25 single born Ireland
1861 35 Widow born Sheffield (she is a boarder)
1871 45 Wife born Ireland
1881 59 Married born Ireland
Possibly 1891 Single born Ireland (she is a servant)

Do you have the birth cert for John Burke born 1857. It will have the address where he was born and the person who registered the birth. Was it Michael?
Dave

PS the grave T214 (Michael Burk 49 in 1858) at General Cemetery is a mass grave owned by the Union. It contains many people, virtually all described as paupers

Dave:

What I have doesn't show any addresses.The record comes from "England Births and Christenings, 1538-1975" Family Search. The record shows:


Name Joannes Burke
Sex Male
Christening Date 14 Jun 1857
Christening Place Sheffield, Yorkshire, England, United Kingdom
Christening Place (Original) St. Vincent of Paul, Sheffield, York, England
Father's Name Michaelis Burke
Father's Sex Male
Mother's Name Ceciliae Magovern
Mother's Sex Female
Event Type Christening

The original document also lists: John Caffrey as godfather and Maria Magovern as godmother.

Carol

Carol, that is the christening. The birth registration is the civil record which from 1837 was and is a legal requirement for all births a legal requirement. You can purchase it online as a pdf document sent to your email address within a few days. Cost £7.
Go to GRO.gov.uk and register (no cost). Then use the search engine to find this record
BURKE, JOHN MCGORVERN
GRO Reference: 1857 J Quarter in SHEFFIELD Volume 09C Page 287.

Click on it to select then choose pdf format to place the order. then just follow instructions.
When you get it after a few days it will have father name, mother name and maiden name, date of birth and place of birth, name and address of the person who went to the register office to register the birth (usually the father or the mother) and date of registration.
Dave

Dave, was St Peter and St Paul church (Cathedral) used for both Catholic and Christian Weddings in those days and if so when did the Catholic Cathedral of Norfolk Row open?

An image of the baptism register is here (image 135)
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-D1JT-CW?i=134
It adds a birthday 21 May 1857.

From our database.

Burke, Joannes (of ~, born 1857-05-21).
Baptised June 14, 1857, by Thoma Plunkett at St Vincents, Sheffield Centre.
Parents name(s) are Ceciliae Magovern & Michaelis ().
Note:
Godparents: Joannes Caffrey Maria Magovern :Page No 127 :Reg No

This is probably our transcription that we supplied the LDS (Family Search) which is what we had to do at that time.

Elaine in Ottawa.

Carol, I should have mentioned that the Civil Birth certificate also contains the father's OCCUPATION. It will be very useful to know what that was in 1857.
Remember in 1878 John said he was a SEAMAN
Dave

Hi Dave et al,
I Have found a sea record on Family Search website for 1861 census:
MICHL. BURKE...AGE:35...EVENT PLACE:Royal Navy at Sea and in Ports abroad...REG.DIST: Ditto....BIRTH YEAR(Est):1826..BIRTHPLACE:Ireland...Married...
OCCUPATION: Leading Stoker.

This puts a hole in my previously stated death record (1858) for Michael. (age 49:ergo birth abt.1809)
MAYBE...the death record for 1876 (age 52 birth abt. 1824) on this site is him... the record does not give an occupation so who knows..??

HAPPY HUNTING :sleuth_or_spy:

Great find on the seaman Wendy.
The 52 year old Michael who died 1876 is in the same grave as Julia Burke b at 1824 (wife?) and Thomas Burke b abt 1852 (son?)
Dave

Thanks, Dave. I ordered the certificate and will be curious to see what it shows.
Carol

Carol et al
Following up on Wendy's seaman find, the 1861 census record is on FMP. He was aboard HMS Sharpshooter

This looks like him (National Archives, Kew.). Note the age and date of volunteering. You can simply download the complete record for only £3.50. If it is right it should mention Cecilia and John

Reference: ADM 139/291/29084
Description:
Name Burke, Michael
Place of Birth: Middleton, Cork
Continuous Service Number: 29084
Date of Volunteering: 07 May 1856
Date of Birth: August 1826, 20 August 1825
Date: [1853-1872]
Held by: The National Archives, Kew
Legal status: Public Record(s)
Closure status: Open Document, Open Description

Ordering and viewing options
£3.50 - sign in to get this free
Download format PDF
Approximate size 11 MB

Dave

Re Dave T's find at Archives:
File has no mention of kin or address other than birthplace. Last discharge seems to be 26 Feb 67 ex the ship "Asia".
Ships include Sharpshooter 25 Nov 57 - 7 Aug 61.

Hi Dave et al,
I have found another possible naval, crew list record for a Michael Burke on Family Search website:
Event Date: Jun, 1889..Event Place: Dublin
Ship's Name:City of Hamburg
Michael Burke...Age 65 (abt1824)..Birthplace Dublin...

Given that his wife Cecilia died a widow in 1899 and given she stated on 1881 census she was still married, might this be our Michael..??.
If correct.. Michael must have died between 1889 and 1899 but when and where..??
HAPPY HUNTING:sleuth_or_spy: