have been trying to find out how Mary A Hayes can be related to Joseph Henry Marshall
What I have found is
1883 Sarah Marshall b1862 daughter of Josiah Marshall b1831 married Charles H Hayes
1885 They had a daughter Mary A Hayes b1885
1891 Census 1891 Census St Michael Leeds
Page Number: 5 RG12 Piece/Folio: 3702/ 28
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Joseph H Marshall Head Male 32 Yorkshire, England
Sarah J Marshall Wife Female 28 Yorkshire, England
Page Number: 6 RG12 Piece/Folio: 3702/ 28
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Sarah E Marshall Daughter Female 0 Yorkshire, England
Mary A Hayes Niece Female 6 England
Note the difference of page no.
1891 Census
1891 Census
Sunny Bank Terrace Stansfield Todmorden
Page 27 RG 12 Piece/folio 3546/61
Household Role Sex Age Birthplace
Charles H Hayes Head Male 30 Yorkshire, England
Sarah Hayes Wife Female 29 Yorkshire, England (nee Marshall)
Mary A Hayes Daughter Female 6 Yorkshire, England
Josiah Marshall Boarder Male 59 Yorkshire,
Edward Bond Boarder Male 38 Lancashire, England
As you can see that everything fits but how can Mary A Hayes be on 2 census forms in different towns at the same time
I still can't find out how she fits in and still can't find Joseph Henry and his father James William Has anybody any thoughts what to do next
Brenda

Brenda could you contact me please.

Your email for some reason doesn`t seem to be working.

Elaine.

Instant Messenger: Skype

I just sent you you an email let me know if you don't get it
Brenda

I recieved it but I dont think your getting my mail for some reason.

I am using the email addy from your mail to me and its the same that I have always used.

Elaine.
Check your spam folder??????

Instant Messenger: Skype

Hi Brenda,

I think the two Mary A Hayes might be different people.

The Mary A Hayes, Niece of Joseph and Sarah J Marshall is,I think aged 8yrs on
the 1891 census. It says she was born in Tydelsley, Lan. There is a Tyldesley
just south of Bolton, Lancashire.
Mary Alice Hays, bap 13 Apr 1884, Bolton-le-Moors, Lancs, parents Ernest and Mary.
On the 1891 census, Ernest and Mary are by themselves, no Mary Alice.
1901 census, 13 Oliver Row, Bolton, Lancs.
Ernest Hays, 41, iron planer born Bolton
Mary Hays, wife, 43, born Bolton.
MARY ALICE Hays, dau, 17, weaver in cotton mill, born Bolton.
Plus five siblings.
As yet I have not found a Hayes/Marshall connection for this family.

Mary A Hayes,aged 6yrs, dau of Charles and Sarah, is, on the 1891 census said to
be born at Stansfield, Yks.

Moira.

Hi Brenda

I've not made the Hayes/Marshall connection yet. But you said you couldnt find Joseph Henry - not sure if you mean before or after 1891, but;

on the 1901 census Joseph Henry and his wife Sarah Jane ( born in Halifax as also mentioned on the 1891 censes when they are in Leeds) are living Court House 3 Bailey Street Sheffield. With sons Joseph E (b 1896 Sheffield) and John W (B 1898 Sheffield). No sign of daughter Sarah E.

All children have MMN Barrett.

Not yet found a marriage for John Henry Marshall and Sarah Jane Barrett, but strangely found a marriage in 1890 for Sarah Jane Barrett to an Alexander Marshall in Lancashire?? Could this be the connection to Moiras Hayes find ?

On the 1911 census Joseph Henry is a widower, living at 13 Brook Lane Shefield with his son Joseph Ed.

Sarah Jane Marshall dies in 1910 in Sheffield
Joseph Henry dies in 1920 in Sheffield

Both are buried together in City Road - Burial is on this site over to the left.

Denise

Edit to earlier post;

I obviously meant couldnt yet find a marriage of Joseph Henry Marshall (not John Henry) and Sarah Jane Barrett. The marriage of an Alexander Marshall to a Sarah Jane Barrett in 1890 in Lancashire turned out to be false alarm!!!

Denise

Moira is right, they were two different Mary Ann Hayes
From GRO index
Mary Ann HEYES birth registered q1 1885 Todmorden mmn MARSHALL
Mary Ann Hayes birth registered q1 1885 Leeds mmn MELLOR

Dave

Sorry, I need to add a correction to my previous post. The Mary Ann Hayes mmn Mellor born 1885 Leeds is in the 1891 census , Leeds, with her parents John and Esther nee Mellor so she is not the one who is niece to Joseph Marshall.
Dave

Hi Brenda,

From my reasoning it has to be at your end or I wouldn't be able to connect to others.

Elaine.

Instant Messenger: Skype

So we still have the same problem of 2 Mary Ann Hayes(Heyes) in the 2 census forms.
She is with her parents at Stansfield and her uncle and aunty at Sheffield in 1891.
Logically if Charles H Hayes was married to Sarah Marshall then she must be the sister of Joseph Henry. Am I reading this right do I have to concentrate on him again
Brenda

Brenda, read Moiras answer. The one in Sheffield is a different person.
Dave

Hi Brenda

I'm not too sure why you think both Mary Ann Hayes (Heyes) are the same person?

They are both different ages and born in different places (counties) according to the 1891 census details.

Can you perhaps explain a bit more about the research you have that makes you think the families are connected. Is your line through Sarah Marshall or through Joseph Henry Marshall? You say that Sarah Marshalls father was Josiah Marshall, but you mention Joseph Henrys father as James William ??

Denise

Just to add/clarify further

Sarah Hayes (nee Marshall) was born in Todmorden (as was her father Josiah)
Charles and Sarah Hayes seem to stay living in the Stansfield/Todmorden area (certainly up to 1911)

Joseph Henry Marshall was born in Sheffield
Sarah Jane Marshall (nee Barrett) was born in Halifax

As per my earlier post, after 1891 when they were living in Leeds, Joseph Henry and Sarah Jane move back to Sheffield and live here until both their deaths.


Denise

I have Find My Past 1891 Census for Buslingthorpe Place Leeds
Joseph H Marshall Head 32 Wire Cleaner Born Sheffield Yorkshire
Sarah J Marshall (Barratt) Wife 28 Born Halifax Yorkshire
Sarah E Marshall Daughter 0 Born Leeds Yorkshire
Mary A Hayes Niece 6 and a - so not sure where she was born so is she the niece of the head of the house

Now my thinking is if Mary A Hayes is the daughter of Sarah (Marshall) Hayes and Charles H Hayes
And Family search 1891 census Harley Wood Todmorden RG 12 Page 27
Charles H Hayes head 30 Born Yorkshire
Sarah Hayes Wife 29 Born Yorkshire
Mary A Hayes daughter 6 Born Yorkshire
Josiah Marshall Boarder 59 Born Yorkshire
Edward Bond 38 Born Lancashire

Freecen Census 1891 All Saints Sunny Bank Terrace Todmorden
Hayes Charles H head 31 Cotton Weaver born Yorkshire
Hayes Sarah wife 29 Born Yorkshire
Mary A Hayes Daughter 6 Born Yorkshire
Marshall Josiah Boarder widower Bobbin Mill Labourer Em'ee 59 Born Yorkshire
Bond Edward Boarder 38 Cotton Weaver Born Lancashire


Family Search 1901 Census St Michael & All Angels Todmorden schedule 98 page 16
Charles H Hayes 40 Head Born Yorkshire
Sarah Hayes wife 39 Born Yorkshire
Mary A Hayes daughter 16 Born Yorkshire
John E Hayes son 8 Born Yorkshire
Josiah Marshall Father In Law 70 Born Yorkshire

Find My Past Marriage Todmorden Yorkshire 1883 Volume 9A Page 420 Line 278
Charles Henry Hayes and Sarah Marshall
It's all a mystery
Brenda

Hi Brenda,

Have you looked at the original census entry for 1891 with Mary A Hayes, Niece
of Joseph H and Sarah J Marshall.
If you look at her age, it looks more like an eight than a six(1883). Also in the
column showing where she was born, it gives 'Tydelsley' and 'Lan' added at the
side of it.
If you refer to my previous entry above, I have explained my findings.

Moira.

I know where your coming from but on the Find my Past census it is clear that she was 6 years old and just a dash for her birth place so is that what they put when a birthplace isn't shown or is it a ditto for Leeds above her name. I don't subscribe to find my past anymore but when I can get to the archives I can find the original and print that out. I think my copy is with my brother. Do you think she could be a daughter of a sister of Joseph Henry as he was born 1859 and Sarah 1863 even though I can't find him with Josiah Marshall
brenda

Hi Brenda,

Yes, on the transcription there is a dash for where Mary A Hayes was born,
but, if you 'View Image', Tydelsley has been entered there.

Moira.

Brenda

You still havent clarified whether its Joseph Henry Marshall or Sarah Hayes (nee Marshall) who is your family line but;

Joseph Henry Marshall (father James William) according to the census was born in Sheffield

Sarah Marshall B 1863 (father Josiah ) who married Charles Hayes was born (and lived) in Todmorden.

These would seem to be 2 different families - but it is a possibility that the 2 fathers James William Marshall and Josiah Marshall could be brothers?

The Mary A Hayes who was living with Joseph Henry and Sarah Jane Marshall in Leeds on the 1891 census, if she is actually a niece could be either;

The daughter of a sister of Sarah Jane (nee Barratt)
The daughter of a sister of Joseph Henry

So I think you need forget about Sarah Hayes B 1863 ( nee Marshall) for the moment and look at those 2 possibilities.

Along with researching James William Marshall and Josiah Marshall each a bit more.

Denise