I am looking for my great grandfather George Fenton's father. He is shown on the 1881 census as living with Mary Ann Fenton (actually Emsley as they never married) at 16 Eyre Lane with 4 children but not my grandfather who was born in 1882 and the Emsley in-laws. George was aged 40 and a Spring Knife cutler. In the 1871 census there is a George Fenton married to Elizabeth Fenton (nee Palfreyman) when he is shown to be 29 and a Spring Knife cutler. I am trying to establish if they are the same person but cannot find if anything happened to Elizabeth or whether they had children. I know they married on 16th April 1866. I am at a brick wall and would welcome any help.

Hi Susan,

Suggestions and observations.

I checked out the 1841 census info over to the left and there are two George Fentons listed, both aged 5 yrs old so not your chap.

His marriage certificate is a must purchase (GRO)and will give his fathers name.
Correct info at an early date is a must.

I have only found him on two census (1871 & 81) in Sheffield which is his stated place of birth in 1871 & 81. He is not on the Sheffield Council BMD site as being registered.

Thats my two cents worth at this time.

Elaine in Ottawa.

PS.

By using FMP the 1836 child seems to look promising.

George Fenton Head Married Male 45 1836 Cutler Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Mary Ann Fenton Wife Married Female 45 1836 Cutler Wife Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
John Fenton Son Single Male 14 1867 Razor Setter In Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Annie Brier Daughter Married Female 19 1862 Silver Burnisher Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Henry Brier Son In Law Married Male 23 1858 Moulder (Iron) Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Walter Brier Brother Single Male 26 1855 Labourer In Wood Yd Sheffield, Yorkshire, England

The marriage to Mary Ann Oates with a father who is called John Fenton. The marriage was in 1859.

Could it be Susan that the two George Fentons only married the once one to Mary Ann and the other to Elizabeth.

Are you descended from the 14yr old John above?

I was concerned that our 1841 census might have George listed as being 5yrs old and he was in actual fact 5 mths. The Morpeth Street child is certainly 5 yrs old (1836) and his father is John and a Spring Knife Manufacturer.

I will try and find the other child.


Elaine.

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Have you looked at the burials on this site George Fenton died in 1888 aged 52 and in the same grave is Mary Ann Emsley who died in 1884 and 38 and was living at 16 Eyre Lane.

If the age is correct for George that means born circa 1836 so my next step would be to check the 1841 census tosee if that helps.

Susan.
The GRO index confirms there are no Fenton births with mmn Palfreyman between 1865 and 1881. That fits with there being no children in the 1871 census.If George left Elizabeth
Or vice versa and George set up home with Emsley they would be unable to marry. (Bigamy). Equally, Elizabeth would also be unable to remarry for the same reason.
You should look for Elizabeth in 1881, possibly shackled up with a man and using his name

58 YEAR OLD Elizabeth Fenton died in Sheffield in 1898.
It fits together.
Dave

Having checked the 1871 census I realise that the 58 yr old Elizabeth Fenton who died in Sheffield in 1898 could not be correct. However a perfect fit for the same scenario would be the death in Sheffield Q4 1936 of Elizabeth Fenton age 86.
Dave

Just to add one more find.

Marriage George Fenton & Elizabeth Palfreyman June qtr 1866 EB. 9c 294.


Elaine.

Two Georges?????

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Thank you for all your hard work. I have just received the marriage certificate of the George Fenton in the 1971 census and his father was Charles Fenton from Dronfield so it is definite that he is not one of the 1941 census Georges. My dilemma is trying to connect him to the 1981 census George where there is circumstantial evidence but nothing definitive at this stage.

What was Charles occupation on the marriage cert.

There is a Glazier and Painter born in Dronfield on the 1861 census census. NO George with him.

Elaine in Ottawa.

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I wonder if this is part of the mystery.

Baptism.

FENTON, Jane (of Green St, born ~).
Baptised August 28, 1874, by C S Wright at St Silas, Gilcar.
Parents name(s) are Elizabeth & George (Cutler).


FENTON, JANE PALFREYMAN
GRO Reference: 1873 S Quarter in ECCLESALL BIERLOW Volume 09C Page 351


On the 1871 census George is with Elizabeth.The addy was 22 Arundle Lane.

He has his sisters in law living with him. One is called Jane.

Elaine.

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Young Jane Fenton died in S quarter 1874 age 1.
The two sisters in law from 1871 census both later married
Ellen Palfreyman to Herbert Shaw Ecclesall Bierlow 1872 and Jane Palfreyman to Jabez Wadey in Rochdale s quarter 1873
In 1881 the Shaws are in Ecclesall Bierlow next door to Ellen's brother and family and the Wadeys are in Croydon.
Dave

Hi Dave et al,
I have found one birth with Fenton/Palfreyman on GRO
JANE FENTON B:1873 Sept.Qtr.Ecc.Bierlow
with possible death of same
Sept. qtr. 1874 Ecc.Bierlow age 1.
If the parents are George and Elizabeth who married in 1866, they seem to have waited a long time before producing any children...??

Ellen Fenton age 11, recorded on the 1881 census for George & Mary A.
also appears on the 1871 census as Ellen Emsley age 1 granddaughter of Thomas and Harriet (Mary A. parents)
Mary A. is recorded as age 20 on same 1871 census.
I have had no luck tracing any records on GRO or BMD for Ellen B: about 1870.
Thomas (B:1874) and Charlotte (B:1880) Fenton on the 1881 census are recorded on GRO as Emsley without a mmn.
George Fenton B1882 is on GRO with mmn Emsley.

GEORGE FENTON B about 1841 with father Charles of Dronfield is recorded as an errand boy age 10 born Sheffield, on the 1851 census. living on Tudor Street Ecclesall Bierlow.

HAPPY HUNTING:sleuth_or_spy:

Ellens birth is registered on GRO Index as Ellen HEMSLEY in Q4 1869 Ecclesall Bierlow.

The birth registrations would seem to indicate that only George 1882 was officially registered as Fenton. So it is possible that the first 3 all registered illegitimate as (H)Emsley may have had anyone as father (including George Fenton).
Was George having an affair with Mary as early as 1869?, or did he hitch up with her after the birth of Charlotte in 1880?, or perhaps somewhere between?
The key to this is to find Elizabeth Fenton nee Palfreyman after she gave birth in 1873 to Jane Fenton.
Dave

Hello everyone

Wow, what a lot of work you've all done. You are right Dave that the key is after Jane was born/died.

My grandfather was George born 1882 and he took Hemsley as his middle name even though it wasn't on his birth certificate. Here are some more pieces of info:-

I thought Jane Palfreyman was married to George Pogmore because Joseph Palfreyman is living with them in the 1881 census at Thomas Street, Ecclesall Bierlow.

Charlotte Emsley was born on 8th September 1880 in 4 Green St, Ecclesall Bierlow with the mother as Mary Ann Emsley of 16 Eyre Lane and she was said to be illegitimate so I think the previous children probably were too. She moved to Accrington as can be seen in the 1901 census and her sister Annie was her witness and she was using Emsley. I haven't any info on Thomas.

I did wonder if Elizabeth and George had had children before Jane and I think there might be a George Fenton who was born/died around 1868 which might fit with their marriage in 1866 but I don't have details.

I still have a suspicion they are the same George and that he went to live with Mary Ann.

Claire, my mistake about the marriage of Jane. I missed that one.
Dave

PS the GROIndex definitely has no other Fenton children with mmn Palfreyman and variants.

Jane Fenton was buried on 2 Sep 1874 aged 1 at Bramall Lane St Mary she was living at 4 Green Street does not mention any parents I'm afraid

Dave,It seems strange no childrem from 1866 t0 1881 ie Fenton/Palfreyman but what would be interesting to find out is how many people were born between 1866 and 1871 say with the mothe's maiden name Palfrayman...what if for example Elizabeth was hitched up with another man, had kids and when the father went to register them he gave the details that Elizabeth was the mother even though not married but gave the kids HIS surname would the registrars in those days check to see if a marriage had taken place between them?

Hi John,

Have you tried doing just that by using FreeBMD or the Sheffield Council Site? Gives you more than the 2yrs search from the GRO. MMN might be a problem.

I believe when I was looking these FRENTON'S were registered in Ecclesall Bierlow.

I also checked out our baptismal records by using just the surname FRENTON farthers name George. Thats how I found Jane.


Elaine in Ottawa.

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John and Elaine,
In principle you are both correct. Unfortunately in that period Free BMD does not have mmn and GRO index will not allow search of mmn unless a surname is entered for the birth. Also GRO does not permit wildcard. Therefore some other way needs to be found to come up with a short list of surnames to try in GRO. That info will be in the censuses, but the problem is how do you find it?
Dave

There is also another possibility that they were Methodists.

Marriages would have taken place in a C of E Church (Cathedral) and then after 1848 more churches were built in Sheffield and the Parishes were formed. My Methodist relatives still took their children to the Cathedral to be baptised right up to about 1900.

Elaine in Ottawa.

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In the 1871 census, living with the Fentons were Elizabeth's sisters Jane (21) and ELLEN (19). Also there was Ann, 3 months old described as niece to George Fenton. This checks with the following baptism
Brunswick Chapel Circuit South Street, denomination Wesleyan Methodist.
13 Nov 1871 baptism Annie Palfreyman (born 21 Dec 1870) mother ELLEN, Father HERBERT.

In Q4 1872 Ellen Palfreyman married HERBERT Shaw.

This may indicate that the Palfreymans were Non conformist.
Dave

Have I just found a connection between the 2 Georges? Jane Fenton was Living at 4 Green Street when born in 1874 and Charlotte Emsley was born at 4 Green Street to Mary Ann Emsley in 1880 although she lived at Eyre Lane or is it that 4 Green Street is where women had their babies?

I went from 1866 to 1880 and took a gable and put the surname of Palfreyman in and went down the list. These are the people born illegitamate in the Sheffield /Ecclesall Bierlow area not saying they are all Elizabeth's but here they are

Charles, Joseph, Walter Edwards and Ann Maud.

John

Susan, in the 1881 census living at 4 GREEN STREET was George Reaney, knife grinder with his family and a couple of lodgers, so not a place for births.
At 14 Green street was John Palfreyman b 1841 and his large family. On GRO index you can show that John, William 1839, Elizabeth 1846, Jane 1848 and Ellen 1851 were siblings with parents Joseph Palfreyman and Jane nee Wigfull or Wigfall who married in 1837 (FMP).
Dave

Susan, going back to an earlier posting you refered to a marriage certificate you recived, Who was the marriage between and where were they living and how sure are you that this is not your George?

Susan, just to clarify the details of some earlier findings by john, elaine and Wendy

Jane Fenton was birth registered q3 1873. Actually the registration was Sept 29 or 30
She was BAPTISED on 28 August 1874 address Green Street
She was BURIED on 4 Sept 1874 address 4 Green Street

So she was baptised on her deathbed

If you buy her birth cert you will get their address in Aug/Sept 1873, if you want that.

Just to complete the picture on Elizabeth PALFREYMANs siblings. There was another brother, Arthur, born 1845. He married in 1873, february. Only a transcription is available onFMP
Dave

Just looking through the postings again if the ages on the burials I have found are correct, then the 1881 census info that Elaine found must be wrong as Mary Ann could not be aged 45 unless this was an error by the enumerator.

We need to find what happened to Elizabeth but what are peoples views that she might be in prison.

Thanks John. The marriage certificate is George Fenton and Elizabeth Palfryman on 16th April 1866. He was 24 and she was 20. He was a Spring Knife cutler and she didn't have a rank. They were both at Trafalgar Street. His father was Charles Fenton, a painter and hers was Joseph Palfryman, a brewer.

I knew that they were on the 1871 census without children living at the back of Andrew Lane and that he was 29 and she was 25. I also knew for certain that George Fenton on the 1881 census living with Mary Ann Emsley living at 16 Eyre Lane was my great grandfather.

I have been investigating whether the two George's are the same and with the information which everyone on this site has provided I am now convinced they are the same. The fact that the daughter of George and Elizabeth, Jane, died at 4 Green Street in 1874 and then Mary Ann Emsley had her baby, Charlotte, at the same address in 1880 seems to mean that George of 1871 and George of 1881 are the same person.

Presumably something happened to Elizabeth after 1874 and before 1880. Certainly George was with Mary Ann Emsley when the census took place in April 1881.

I am very grateful to everyone for all their input and help.

John, people in prison could not escape the census.

Sometimes in this family history research there are some very sad discoveries.
On 28th August 1874 at St Sils Gilcar there were two connected baptisms

Jane Fenton of Green St parents George and ELIZABETH (nee Palfreyman)
Elizabeth Palfreyman of Green St parents JOHN and Sarah Ann.

JANE was buried a few days later
JOHN was ELIZABETH's brother
Dave

George Fenton:- There are alot of age descrepencies regarding this Gentleman.

If burial register is right in 1888 when he died he was 52 so born 1836
census in 1881 he was 45 so born 1836
census in 1871 he was 29 so born 1842
marriage in 1866 he was 24 so born 1842

somewhere along the line we need to find 6 years I know sometimes ages can be 1 or 2 out but 6 seems to me more intriguing I think the key to this could be finding George and Elizabeth on the 1851 census.

could the 6 years in age difference be the reason Elizabeth left him we know she did not die otherwise George would have married Mary Ann.

John

Co-incidently, George and Mary Ann are buried in the same grave as my Grandmothers brothers son, William Herbert Hardwick although that was 1928 and of no relation I am aware of.

Hi Richard. What an amazing co-incidence. I agree that I think there is no connection.

Dave, Have you any thoughts on another part of the mystery? George died on 18th September 1888 at Court 2, Cross Burgess Street aged 52 from phthisis. He was a Spring Knife Cutler journeyman. The informant was Elizabeth Warner, sister-in-law, who was present at the death. I have no idea who Elizabeth Warner is and haven't located her anywhere. I know George had siblings Richard who was married to Jane Jackson, James b 1838 but don't know about him, and the others were sisters Ann b 1836 and Mary b 1846. George seems full of mystery.

just chaging tact a minute, Susan when did you apply for the marriage certificate for George Fento to Elizabeth Palfreyman please was it while the restrictions were in place at the GRO? Reason I ask is tha its two months since I applied for a birth cert and not received it yet. I did apply for a marriage cert in May and that came after 3 weeks.

Hi John. Yes, I applied for it on 12th May and it came last week although the receipt says they despatched on 18th May. Hope this helps. Sue

Thanks Sue. I might just have to contact them. I know it says no but 8 weeks seems along time.

John, I ordered 3 marriage certs on 16 april and 2 marriage and one birth on 24th april. I have received 5 about beginning June. The missing one is a 1960s marriage cert ordered 16th april. I have filled out a complaint form on line and the auto response says it has recorded my response and something will happen at some unspecified time
Dave

Hi Susan,

This mystery just wont go away but it is very interesting.

I think I found something else that might help going back.

I used Family Search by the way. 1851 census.

Household
Role
Sex
Age
Birthplace
Charles Fentem Head Male 44 Dronfield, Derbyshire
Mary Fentem Wife Female 42 Maltby, Yorkshire
Ann Fentem Daughter Female 15 Sheffield, Yorkshire
James Fentem Son Male 13 Sheffield, Yorkshire
George Fentem Son Male 10 Sheffield, Yorkshire
Richard Fentem Son Male 8 Sheffield, Yorkshire
Mary Fentem Daughter Female 5 Sheffield, Yorkshire
John Fentem Son Male 1 Sheffield, Yorkshire

I have looked at so much information that I am seeing Fentons everywhere. LOL. I do believe that Georges brother John was also a Spring Knife Cutler. OR it could have been Charles brother.:wink:

Elaine.

New info..........

We have two George Fentons. Both born in 1836 PLUS George son of Charles born 1840
Same occupation and a wife named Mary Ann.

1871 census.
Household
Role
Sex
Age
Birthplace
George Fenton Head Male 35 Sheffield, Yorkshire Spring Knife Cutler.
Mary A Fenton Wife Female 35 Sheffield, Yorkshire
Tom Fenton Son Male 14 Sheffield, Yorkshire
Edwin Fenton Son Male 11 Sheffield, Yorkshire
Annie Fenton Daughter Female 9 Sheffield, Yorkshire
John Fenton Son Male 4 Sheffield, Yorkshire

I believe we had agreed that your George was still with Elizabeth in 1871 thats when he had his Palfreyman sisters in law living with him.

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Susan, a quick look at Elizabeth Warner is drawing a total blank from every angle.
Are you absolutely certain that is the name?
Dave

from the GRO index George FENTEM born March quarter 1840 Ecclesall Bierlow RD mothers maiden name Boler

Richard born 1843 is also registered with the surname FENTEM

So is the family Elaine found a different one or is it the correct one and the surname just been spelt incorrrectly by the registrar and enumerator on the census.

I have not been able to find the family on the 1841 census yet.

Interesting marriage at Sheffield Parish Church in 1834 Charles Fantom to Mary Boaler.
(only found this on my cd wonder if its on FMP)

On Fmp 9th Nov 1834 Charles Fantom to Mary Boaler FMP indexed Mary as Bealer and I am sure Chrles surname is Fanton, the actual image is on FMP so judge for yourself.

On FMP there is a marriage cert for George Hemsley Fenton (carter) (22) mar.Lily Hallam (20) on 7 August 1905.

George gives father as Thomas Fenton (dec) Cutler

Both living 9 Cotton Mill Row.

Wits are:Jhon Hawkworth (sic) & Ellen Furniss

If this is your g-father, there is the obvious possibility that he didn't know his father as he would have died when your g-father was 6 and could have been mi-informed, however just another mystery to throw into the mix.

That has thrown a spanner in the works, we need to try and find George Hemsley Fenton now on the 1901 census.


1901 census 90 Rockingham Lane, Sheffield

George Fenton was classed as relative to Thomas Emsley who was the head Thomas was 56 and a widower. Think that solves the Thomas problem.

It would appear that is a very viable call John.

Although Thomas isn't deceased in 1905 and is on the 1911 census in the workshoue.

I have seen allsorts on marriage certs in my experience.

Would be interesting to get the full transcript of George b1882 birth cert Susan.

Thomas's wife was called elizabeth and she died in 1901 just before the census yet I have not been able to find her burial.

Query "Cemetery City Road, Cemetery Area ~, Section C1, Number 2671" returned 5 results, see also How to Search.

BROUGHTON, Thomas (Raiolway Employee, age 45).
Died at 7ct 5 StJohns Rd; Buried on May 15, 1930 in Consecrated ground;
Grave Number 2671, Section C1 of City Road Cemetery, Sheffield.
Parent or Next of Kin if Available: ~. Remarks: .
Plot Owner: ~ ~ of ~. Page No 298
Find Similar in Same Grave Same Household if Available Surname Match if Available

Emsley, Elizabeth (married, age 60).
Died at Ecclesall Workhouse; Buried on March 11, 1901 in Consecrated ground;
Grave Number 2671, Section C1 of City Road Cemetery, Sheffield.
Parent or Next of Kin if Available: ~. Remarks: .
Plot Owner: ~ ~ of ~. Page No 1376
Find Similar in Same Grave Same Household if Available Surname Match if Available

LAWRENCE, Beatrice Alice (Retired, age 73).
Died at Staniforth Rd; Buried on November 17, 1966 in Consecrated ground;
Grave Number 2671, Section C1 of City Road Cemetery, Sheffield.
Parent or Next of Kin if Available: ~. Remarks: ~.
Plot Owner: ~ ~ of ~. Page No 189
Find Similar in Same Grave Same Household if Available Surname Match if Available

LAWRENCE, Henry Duncan (Engineer, age 65).
Died at Crimicar Lane Hospital; Buried on August 20, 1948 in Consecrated ground;
Grave Number 2671, Section C1 of City Road Cemetery, Sheffield.
Parent or Next of Kin if Available: ~. Remarks: ~.
Plot Owner: ~ ~ of ~. Page No ~
Find Similar in Same Grave Same Household if Available Surname Match if Available

SLINN, Rose Emma (Widow, age 77).
Died at 29 Southend Place; Buried on March 19, 1955 in Consecrated ground;
Grave Number 2671, Section C1 of City Road Cemetery, Sheffield.
Parent or Next of Kin if Available: ~. Remarks: ~.
Plot Owner: ~ ~ of ~. Page No ~
Find Similar in Same Grave Same Household if Available Surname Match if Available

Ah!

Thomas and Elizabeth (Oldale), married in 1883 Widow and widower, Fathers are Thomas Emsley (Painter) & James Corthorn (Table knife hafter) both living Bramall Lane

wits are: GEORGE FENTON & MARY ANN EMSLEY

Its on FMP

Susan, the only person with the name Elizabeth I can find who could classify herself as sister in law to George is Ann Elizabeth Emsley, younger sister of Mary Ann Emsley.
However I can find no indication of an official marriage to a Warner.
It would be consistent with this family for there to be a common law marriage so cannot rule her out.
That seems to be the best bet. It is worth noting that there was an older sister Elizabeth who died age 1, so perhaps Ann Elizabeth chose to use her second name.
Dave

It appears that Thomas is the brother of Mary Ann

1851 on Eyre Lane


Household Members
Members that resided in the household at the time of the census.
First name(s) Last name Relationship Marital status Sex Age Birth year Occupation Birth place
Thomas Emsley Head Married Male 29 1822 Carpet Weaver Leeds, Yorkshire, England
Harriett Emsley Wife Married Female 33 1818 - Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Thomas Emsley Son Unmarried Male 4 1847 Scholar Sheffield, Yorkshire, England
Mary A Emsley Daughter Unmarried Female 1 1850 - Sheffield, Yorkshire, England

Great find. Haven't been able to find the death of Thomas yet unless indexed wrongly on free bmd site. I we need to sit back a bit and perhaps draw a rough tree to see what is what Nevertheless we still need to find out what happened to Elizabeth Fento (nee Palfreyman) after 1873

Susan, I am now on the hunt for Eliabeth nee Palfreyman, when she married George what did she do for a living.

Richard, are the burgess rolls on FMP please if not where are they?

Thomas Emsley was the brother of Mary Ann Emsley, who was the mother of George Fenton.
Clearly after George Fenton Senior died in 1888 George junior was brought up by his uncle.
John is right, the problem to be solved remains to find what happened to Elizabeth Fenton after 28th August 1874.
I wonder if after such a traumatic experience she became institutionalised, though that would not explain why she disappeared from all the subsequent censuses
Dave

The burgess rolls are on here John, under directories.

Good day to everyone and what a lot more information you have all found. Thankyou. I'll try and answer a few queries and add a few notes.

The death certificate of George Fenton who died in 1888 shows Elizabeth Warner in very clear writing as the person who registered the death and she made her mark on the certificate. I compared the way her name was written with the rest of the document and can't make it read anything else but Warner.

John - On the marriage certificate there is no rank or profession for Elizabeth.

On the 1891 census George is living with Thomas Emsley. I agree that since he was orphaned by 1888 when he was 6 he was likely brought up by the Emsleys and by the time he was getting married quoted Thomas as his father although we all know it was George and I have his birth certificate to this effect.

Richard - Great information from the Burgess Rolls showing George at 4 Green St 1875-1876.

Out of interest I found an Emily Fenton who died aged 1 hr in 1905 at the back 46 Bramall Lane so the Fenton family was definitely in that area. I don't know who her parents were. Ellen Emsley, George's sister, appears to be a cook at Cricketers Arms, 106/108 Bramall Lane in the 1901 census so it makes you wonder if there is a connection here.

On Ancestry there is a substantial Gwynne Family Tree which leads from Charles Fenton 1807-1871 married to Mary Fenton b.1809

I think the Charles Fenton and Charles Fentem are the same It's interesting to note that his wife Mary was born in Maltby according to the 1851 census All the children were born in Sheffield so taking the eldest at 15 in 1851 they were in Sheffield from at least 1836

Dave - good thought about Ann Elizabeth Emsley being the one who was at his death.

what a shame Elizabeth was not doing anything when she married I was hoping to at least eliminate a few of those on the 1881 census to try and find her. I presume when she married she was a spinster.

perhaps someone could enlighten me that if people lived apart for more then 7 years could the marriage be annuled?

Probably a long shot but could the Elizabeth that married Thomas Emsley in 1883 be our missing Elizabeth? Probably not just a thought thats all.

Could in fact it be George that was upto no good and thats why Elizabeth left?

We know Jane Fenton died in 1874 aged 1 and was living at Green Sreet it would be interesting to know how Jane died and who the informant was. Jane more likely died of natural causes but I just wonder if jane had been injured in someway.

John

Susan, the gro index identifies Emily Fenton born 1905 Ecclesall Bierlow as having mmn Wainwright.
From Free BMD Richard Fenton married Emily Wainwright 1892 Ecclesall Bierlow.
Dave

Morning all.

JohnS. The occupation of brides was NOT entered in the registers well into the 1900's.


*** I am getting a little concerned about the space we are using on the FORUM.******

Might I suggest that Susan gives us her line of research from two generations after George. We can then go back to Charles? Basically what I am asking is to work offline drawing in all the info we have accumulated so far.

Hope its not too much to ask.......


Elaine in Ottawa.

PS just thought I would add.
Could the 1871 & 1881 census be two different Georges throwing us completely out of wack.

And yes DaveT I had also thought maybe she was in Middlewood for a number of years.
And Yes JohnS the seven year absence did lead to folks believing they were free to Marry again. NOT in more recent times but the belief was there. Happened in my family.

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There was never in the 19th Century any standing in LAW that separation of 7 years , or any other period, could lead to automatic annulment. If anyone believed that and acted upon it they will have committed bigamy, a criminal offence
Dave

Edit. The 7 year rule specifically applies to presumption of death when someone has disappeared without trace. It did not apply to voluntary separation. it required, and still requires, a court ruling before becoming legal

Hi Dave,

Yup you have hit the explanation right on the head. Thats exactly what happened to my GG/aunt. BUT he wasn't dead and lived miles away from her. BUT it was the seven years.....
I believe they posted requests if anyone knew the whereabouts etc etc in many news papers Around the country. The gentleman in question did re marry.


Elaine in Ottawa.

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Thank you everyone for all the information. I am now convinced that the George in 1871 is the same as the one in 1881, the connection being 4 Green Street. Only what happened to Elizabeth Fenton is the real mystery.

I am sorry that so much space has been taken up on the forum and am happy to work offline so feel free to email me if you wish to although I think you may all have exhausted your lines of search.

To recap what we know my grandfather George Fenton was born 13.10.1882 at 16 Eyre lane to George Fenton and Mary Ann Emsley who used the name Fenton in the 1881 census. There were 4 other children before George: Ellen b.1870, Annie born 1872, Thomas born 1874 and Charlotte born 1880. I have yet to get their birth certificates but I know that Charlotte was born at 4 Green Street.

Charles, father of George, was born 1807 in Dronfield and was married to Mary. They had Ann b. 1836, James born 1838, George b. 1841, Richard b. 1843 and Mary born 1846.

I think that Charles' father was called John but I don't know his wife. I believe that they had George b. 1795, John born 1797, Thomas born 1800, Samuel born 1802, Charles born 1807 and James born 1808 all in Dronfield.