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Willie Williams death record.

I am trying to find a record of my great grand father's death. I know he was born in Sheffield on 21st of May 1855 and was still alive in the 1911 census. In 1911 he was living with his third wife Mary Anne Kelly at 265 Lumley Street in Attercliffe. I can't find any record of his death. Any help would be appreciated.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Hi

This appears to be the burial of Mary Ann, but there is no Willie buried with her. (Have you already found this?)

Williams, Mary Ann (Wife of Willie, age 54).
Died at 265 Lumley St; Buried on July 31, 1911 in General Portion ground;
Grave Number 11564, Section AA of City Road Cemetery, Sheffield.

Angela

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Morning Chris,

Have you noticed there seem to be two Willie Williams floating around Sheffield?

One died in 1904.

The 1911 census states that Willie was born in Cardiff Wales. None of the children were born in Sheffield. Could they have moved away after Mary Ann's death in 1911.

Elaine in Ottawa.

Instant Messenger: Skype

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Hi Chris,

There is a burial on this site for a Willie Williams in 1919.
His age is given as 60 years (1859), but depending on who arranged
the funeral, they might not have know his exact age. See the burial
records in left hand column.

Moira.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Hi Chris
There are two in memorial messages in the Sheffield Evening Telegraph in 1920 corresponding to the burial that Moira has mentioned.
The first message is from son and daughter Dolly and Harry.
The second is from sons and daughters Charlie, Billy, Ethel, Lottie and Mrs Kelly.
I am not sure whether this is the correct family but I will email you the newspaper article
Sue

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Thank you very much, you have cleared up something I had been searching for some time.

I had seen the burial record on this site, it did not agree with the information that I had. My great grandfather would have been 63 in February 1919 not 60 and he did not live at 47 Catcliffe Road. Though 47 Catcliffe may have been a hospital or hospice. The major reason I discounted that burial record was because the 1911 Census taken on April 2nd 1919 showed him alive and well and living on Lumley Road.

The memorials in the Sheffield papers on February 5th 1920 from his sons and daughters confirmed it was indeed my great grandfather because they were from grandfather and his siblings.

Thanks again, it just goes to show you can't totally trust official records, strange that you could be dead and buried for two months but shown as alive and breathing in the Census.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Chris, there are many things which may be inaccurate within official records, and there are often good reasons for those inaccuracies, as Moira pointed out with regard to death ages. However , you can be certain that the 1911 census was not taken in 1919. Your great grandfather lived for almost 8 years after the 1911 census, giving him plenty of time to move to a new address.
Dave

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Yeah you are right Dave. Having a brain freeze or something on the Census. It was the age and the address of the burial record that made me doubt it. But like I said the memorials in the papers confirmed it was the one I was looking for.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Willie seems to have several birth places - in 1881 he is born Brightside. In 1911 he says Caroliff, Wales and I wonder if that could be Catcliffe, Wales Sheffield.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

I have seen the Census records where my great grandfather's birth is Sheffield in some and Cardiff in another. Same thing with my grandfather.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Someone on Ancestry is researching the same family and it actually shows Willies birth certificate in Sheffield 21 May 1855. Father James mother Ann formerly France
Another interesting fact - Willie was living next door to Mary Ann Kelly in Leighton Buzzard on the 1901 census. They married in Sheffield 1905

Re: Willie Williams death record.

That would be one of my cousins in Sheffield, we have been sharing information. We have traced the Williams family back to the 1770's and are filling in some missing details like when our great grandfather died.

Leyton Buzzard is interesting, not sure how the family got there but 3 of my grandfather's siblings were born there and his mother is buried there. Willie had a history of marrying women who lived on the same street as him and his wife. That is how he met his second wife in Sheffield.

I have seen 6 censuses that Willie Williams is in and his birth place changes between Sheffield and Cardiff and back again. It was only when i saw a birth certificate that I knew he was born in Sheffield. It was the same with my grandfather, who we always thought he was born in Cardiff, but we have a birth certificate that says he was born in Sheffield. Not sure if that is the Census takers fault or whether Willie who seemed to be a bit of a rouge fibbing to the Census takers.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

I still wonder if it Catcliffe which is about 6 miles from Wales Sheffield - perhaps his strong Yorkshire brogue was misheard.

Re: Willie Williams death record.

Sue and Chris.
I am certain that the 1911 census record does not say Cardiff. That looks like a mistranscription. The word definitely starts CA and ends LIFF with 2 letters between. What do others think please?
Also there is no doubt that in 1855 the village of Catcliffe,as Sue has said, was in the Ecclesiastical district of Wales. The village is still there about 6 miles east of Sheffield centre.
As far as I know the 1911 census return form was provided beforehand to each address and the household completed it. Therefore presumably Willie himself wrote it, not the enumerater. So it cannot be a mishearing by the enumerator.
What is his birth address as recorded on his birth cert?
Dave

Re: Willie Williams death record.

The address on the birth certificate is 3 court Wicker Brightside Bierlow. Hard to make out though.