THE VOICE CONNECTION
SOUND OFF

Welcome to The Voice Connection Sound Off; a forum for users of books like Raise Your Voice, Melody to Madness, The Ultimate Breathing Workout, and Unleash Your Creative Mindset, as well as a place for Vendera Vocal Academy members to interact.

This message board was created so that singers could come together and "sound off" to help support each other during vocal development and the creative process of unleashing the creative spark that occurs when writing and producing music. Currently, myself and vocal coaches Ben Valen, Ray West, and Ryan Wall are here to respond periodicially to your questions, with new vocal coaches coming soon. But, feel free to help each other too:)

This board is here for you to ask questions about my and my fellow coach's books, videos, and MP3 programs, as well as offer others help with our vocal techniques. You may also post videos of yourself and your band to share your music and ask for critiques.

Please refrain from negative comments, profanities, spamming, and inappropriate criticisms of vocal methodologies, vocal coaches, and singers. All negative posts will be deleted and subject to banning without question. I will not respond to negative posts, because, as Mark Twain once said, “Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.” With that said, positive criticism is welcome because that is how you'll grow as a singer during the training process.


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Over-singing?

Hi everyone!

Firstly, I am new to here - I have spoken to Jaime a few times via Facebook and finally gotten around to getting my **** in gear and actually joining the Raise Your Voice elite ;)

I have been singing and studying voice for around 10 years now, as well as performing in a number of rock/metal bands. A few years ago I started having voice problems and was unfortunately diagnosed with a vocal polyp. Thankfully I was told it was caused by acid reflux due to my suffering from CFS and not of my own doing which was a relief. Since then I have struggled to find time to practice in full volume due to my accommodations generally being flats (I am very respectful of others) and my financial situation, but have kept up a regime of exercises and singing at half volume. Which brings us until present...

I have been in an Iron Maiden covers band and recently had an audition (the recent post Jaime put up regarding a UK band) and have found issues. I am finding that when I sing full-volume I seem to be losing a chunk of my higher range and finding it very hard to even get up there. I always try and stay as relaxed as possible and really focus on the support to the point my diaphragm and abdominals ache, but it just isn't happening. Before my operation I was told by a tutor I saw a few times I had around 5 and a half octaves on a good day, B1-D6, but apart from losing some of the higher falsetto due to lack of use, have managed to regain the rest of my range in mid volume voice and with better clarity and control, and can add grit quite effectively (still vast room for improvement as there will always be...hence I am here). As I have previously said, it just goes wrong somewhere when I try and kick the volume up full and I am finding this incredibly frustrating especially as it could potentially mean missing out on a great opportunity at present. Could it be that I am putting too much compression or load on my voice, or something like weakness in my vocal chords? I have recently cut out caffeine and smoking (never smoked heavily) in a desperate attempt to highlight where the issue lies. I do have a few audition videos I did last year for Kamelot and they do really highlight what I mean, but no idea how to share them other than maybe Youtube and a link?

Any advice on this would be great and very much appreciated
Regards
Lewis

Re: Over-singing?

Lewis, maybe you have a habit of singing too loud. You don't have to be super loud on the highs and maybe you do need more focus on the resonant tone as opposed to the volume;)

Re: Over-singing?

That is more than likely - my vocal therapist did say I spoke very loudly in general. What could I do to resolve that? I have been looking at wireless in-ear monitors, but obviously they can cost £££. Otherwise is there anything specifically I can do other than making a concious effort to ease back?

Re: Over-singing?

Hey there :)

http://vamacoustics.com/

If in- ears are too expensive, try a Vocal Acoustic Monitor!

Loud singing is ok as long as you play by the rules:
1.) Use as little consonant sounds as possible (like myles kenned
or chris cornell)
2.) keep your throat opened and use little jaw movement
3.) use as little air as possible to create the sounds
4.) support like a banshee!!! just kerp it away from the throat

Personally, I tend to use my diaphragm to the absolute extreme.
Very tiring for my diaphragm but good for my voice :))
I guess my technique is not perfect yet but my voice is healthy!

Get yourself in top physical shape (if you aren't already)
This is one of the main factors to sustain this kind of singing.
Without being in great shape I wouldn't be able to sustain my 1 hour
exercises and 20+ songs every day.

I really hope that I could help you.
Open throat technique is the key to
powerful singing but narly strong diaphragmic support is the engine!
After all we are vocal athletes!!!!

I am sure you will soon have overcome your issues.
Back when I had vocal issues I took zinc, gargled with
liquid licorice and got lots of sleep.
Luckily I don't have any vocal problems anylonger
but zinc still helps me to keep in top shape!

All the best :)
René

Re: Over-singing?

Congrats on quitting smoking. If your voice is really loud during your lower register but then you can't access your upper register, you are probably pulling chest. This means that the front of your larynx is raising to pull the vocal cords when you ascend through your range as opposed to the larynx tilting forwards and the back raising. Try the slides focusing on dropping the jaw as in the yawn sensation to initiate mixing between your chest and head voice. Hope that helps!

Val

Re: Over-singing?

Sorry it has taken me so long to get back to you - working all hours and wanted to try out a few of the recommendations and work on them so I had some results.

Thanks so much for the feedback and looks like I have cracked it - it seems I was trying to sing too loud, and in the process pulling chest in order to force that extra volume. Spent several hours per day while I was and work doing full sirens and scales really focusing on the breaks, followed by some quiet singing along to Myles Kennedy and Daniel Heiman and keeping it entirely tension and strain free as I know their blends are amongst the best. Even hindered by the obligatory post-smokers cold, I can now pass over it without issue, and actually better than I ever have, so I just need to make sure I don't instinctively revert to old habits. Also working on adding the grit - again Myles and Brent Smith are ideal for this as both quite distinctive and at opposite ends of tonality. Sung along to the likes of Jorn Lande and Russell Allen for years so the extra tips on ES2 on the focus and compression have really helped to improve on this.

Heading into a rehearsal studio tomorrow to really let go and get some recordings down to make sure things sound just as good outside of my head.
Will post up the resulting recordings to be scrutinised to your hearts content ;-)

Lewis

Re: Over-singing?

Right - as I said I went into a rehearsal room to record some bits. Unfortunately the recording hardware and setup went to hell so ended up with my mono condenser in one ear, I-Pod with full tracks (not vocal removed) in the other, whilst trying to figure out why my pre-amp was being so aggressive clipping and compressing. The pitch is a bit wavy at times as by this point I was pretty tired and was a bit lazy. Anyway, these are first and only takes, and the only editing is a light reverb and removal of the track between vocal parts as there was a very good, but very load Jazz band in the room next door.

Any and all criticism welcome

http://sharesend.com/8n9yv5km - Wonderful Life Demo.mp3
http://sharesend.com/uol5m3uf - Diamond Eyes Demo.mp3

Cheers
Lewis

Re: Over-singing?

I know you said that wireless in-ears are expensive, but if your budget can stretch to in-ears, definitely go for it.
The rest of the band are probably packing gear that's worth 4 figure money, so a couple of hundred for a decent in-ear monitor set-up is relatively small beer, eh? Better still, it will stop you going deaf and stop you over-singing, so you'll be able to sing for ever and you'll sound good... and then you'll get the gigs and earn the money to pay back the cost of the in-ears! That's how I managed to convince myself, anyway!
I switched from a wedge monitor to in-ears a year or so ago, and I'd never go back.

If you are playing bigger venues, with lots of space, and a permanent in-house PA, regular stage monitoring might be ok, but you still have the problem of sound checking and hoping the sound engineer doesn't screw up your mix mid-gig.

However, if you are playing smaller venues (pubs / bars / clubs) and maybe even using your band's own PA, then you are going to have to sort out your own sound anyway, whether it's using a wedge or in-ears. On-stage wedges just increase the over all noise level in a small venue, and there's a big risk of associated feedback, so in-ear monitors cut out all the problems in one go.

There are various makes & models - LD Systems make pretty cheap & reliable wireless monitor systems. You should be able to get one second hand for less than a hundred quid (that's $150 for our US cousins).

You can even save on all the batteries during practice sessions by getting a cheap in-line headphone amp / monitor - just use a long headphone extension lead to the amp/monitor box rather your wireless pack. Behringer make a dirt-cheap unit called Headphone Amplifier Micromon MA400 for less than thirty quid ($40?).

There are other benefits of wireless in-ear monitors too... you can run all over the stage whilst performing and still hear yourself perfectly... also, when you leave the room during a practice session, you can secretly listen-in to all the so-called "musicians" slagging you off behind your back!
Heh, heh, heh!!!!



CU, Stu

Re: Over-singing?

Hey!
Thanks for the input man!
LD Systems was a brand I have been looking at, and so have Shure and Sennheiser of course. It is definitely my next purchase but financial issues are my bane at present (oh the joy)

That is a good idea for rehearsals though and one I never thought of - I have an ART-preamp and a great set of recording headphones! Brilliant!

Which are the inner ear monitors you have used and any preferences/personal reviews?

Regards
Lewis