THE VOICE CONNECTION
SOUND OFF

Welcome to The Voice Connection Sound Off; a forum for users of books like Raise Your Voice, Melody to Madness, The Ultimate Breathing Workout, and Unleash Your Creative Mindset, as well as a place for Vendera Vocal Academy members to interact.

This message board was created so that singers could come together and "sound off" to help support each other during vocal development and the creative process of unleashing the creative spark that occurs when writing and producing music. Currently, myself and vocal coaches Ben Valen, Ray West, and Ryan Wall are here to respond periodicially to your questions, with new vocal coaches coming soon. But, feel free to help each other too:)

This board is here for you to ask questions about my and my fellow coach's books, videos, and MP3 programs, as well as offer others help with our vocal techniques. You may also post videos of yourself and your band to share your music and ask for critiques.

Please refrain from negative comments, profanities, spamming, and inappropriate criticisms of vocal methodologies, vocal coaches, and singers. All negative posts will be deleted and subject to banning without question. I will not respond to negative posts, because, as Mark Twain once said, “Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level and then beat you with experience.” With that said, positive criticism is welcome because that is how you'll grow as a singer during the training process.


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j
James
Nov 13, 2007 - 9:08PM
Disturbed, Rise Against, Strung Out - how do they do it?

These are 3 bands that I love. The singers for all these bands regularily hit the Bb4ish range. When they do this, it doesn't sound to me like they are using what Brett Manning calls the head voice.

Rise Against Bb4 (33 seconds in) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UV1K9pO77ro

Disturbed Bb4 (28 seconds in) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2I2b64-ykyE

To me, these guys sound like they are "pulling up chest," but the Bb4 is not going SPLAT, like how Brett Manning demonstrates in his cd lessons. So what do I need to accomplish to be able to do that?

j
James Fater
Nov 14, 2007 - 12:42AM
Re: Disturbed, Rise Against, Strung Out - how do they do it?

They're just singing in a really really dirty full voice. They're in their head voice.

r
Rhumbus the Bombest
Nov 14, 2007 - 1:18AM
Re: Disturbed, Rise Against, Strung Out - how do they do it?

There's a free lesson on the site called "Screaming for Vengeance". Check it out.

a
altered
Nov 14, 2007 - 2:20AM
Re: Disturbed, Rise Against, Strung Out - how do they do it?

What's up James,

I can't give you concrete facts on this matter, but I can tell you what I've noticed in the past 2 years of trying to sing in these exact ranges. (e4 to c5)

All I can say is that it is a slow process strengthening this range in your voice to be able to with stand the the pressures and muscle coordination involved in producing grit. We must remember that some people have different ranges, different breaks, different strengths and weaknesses. In my case, the midrange in my voice was extremely weak...with time and practice its getting a hell of a lot better.

I don't know brett mannings program, but I'm fairly certain this is not headvoice. Headvoice singing with grit inflection sounds more like Brian Johnson form ACDC or Axl Rose. Headvoice is usually higher than these notes in these songs.

These guys aren't pulling up chest either...they have very strong mid ranges. There's a lot of debate as where vocal chords start to adduct and turn into headvoice...I dont wanna talk about it too much cuz I dont really know the technical aspects of it...BUT this range is typically the hardest for low voice males because it's that transition area from pure chest to pure headvoice. It's a blend of the two. So it takes a lot of practice and coordination to develop.

My suggestion: Practice everyday using the methods in RYV 1 or 2, work everyday, everyday on it. Eventually it will start showing up slowly. There is no quick fix, nothing you can change today and will be able to sing like that tomorrow. It's the gradual practicing and acquiring muscle memory and knowledge...after awhile, it just comes.

j
James
Nov 14, 2007 - 7:28AM
Re: Disturbed, Rise Against, Strung Out - how do they do it?

"What's up James,

I can't give you concrete facts on this matter, but I can tell you what I've noticed in the past 2 years of trying to sing in these exact ranges. (e4 to c5)

All I can say is that it is a slow process strengthening this range in your voice to be able to with stand the the pressures and muscle coordination involved in producing grit. We must remember that some people have different ranges, different breaks, different strengths and weaknesses. In my case, the midrange in my voice was extremely weak...with time and practice its getting a hell of a lot better.

I don't know brett mannings program, but I'm fairly certain this is not headvoice. Headvoice singing with grit inflection sounds more like Brian Johnson form ACDC or Axl Rose. Headvoice is usually higher than these notes in these songs.

These guys aren't pulling up chest either...they have very strong mid ranges. There's a lot of debate as where vocal chords start to adduct and turn into headvoice...I dont wanna talk about it too much cuz I dont really know the technical aspects of it...BUT this range is typically the hardest for low voice males because it's that transition area from pure chest to pure headvoice. It's a blend of the two. So it takes a lot of practice and coordination to develop."

My suggestion: Practice everyday using the methods in RYV 1 or 2, work everyday, everyday on it. Eventually it will start showing up slowly. There is no quick fix, nothing you can change today and will be able to sing like that tomorrow. It's the gradual practicing and acquiring muscle memory and knowledge...after awhile, it just comes."

I practice RYV daily. I've ordered RYV2.

When I sing in my mid range, it sounds like I'm pulling up chest. I know it's a short time, but after 3 months of daily practice, RYV has not helped me with this. My mid range notes go SPLAT, like Brett Manning warns against in Singing Success. Of course I'll continue to practice, trying new things.

I figured it was mid range. The Bb4 sounds way to much like their chest notes to be headvoice. Now I just have to learn how to lay off the chest, and access my midrage. Thanks for the tips guys.

j
Jaime Vendera
Nov 14, 2007 - 7:50AM
Re: Disturbed, Rise Against, Strung Out - how do they do it?

If you are really practicing my exercises, then you will be reaching those notes in a clear tone in a little heavier sound than what Brett uses. Once you can do them clean, it's just a matter of adding the grit to your voice, which I explain the real secrets this time around in RYV II I am aslo working on a grit program that seems like it is taking an eternity to complete. My parts are basically done, I am just waiting on the company to finish theirs.

JV

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