Hey guys
Just been making more progression recently, and one thing thats really starting to sound better is my head voice.
Since ive been trying to develop it, everytime i kno theres a head voice part in a song, im conciously aware of it, and i conciously make the transition into head voice, but ive been having problems with trying to match the tone of my head voice with my chest.
But now ive realised that ive got to the stage where i dont need to think about it now, and when i forget about chest voice and head voice, and just try and hit the note without thinking 'i have to go into headvoice for this', i just automatically go into head voice but the tone is matched alot more with my chest voice tone.....
so im not longer trying to hit the note in head voice, im just trying to hit the note.....if you get what i mean?

I think im gonna post a video up later thats gonna be a nice view inside of my mouth when im singing :P
Im still a bit bothered about my tongue on my high chest voice notes...it rises quite a bit at the back, i just want someones opinion on whether its ok or not.

Good for you Lee! This is what I do to pevent stress to overtake on my tongue: pretend to say "GN" just in front of that vowel you are singing by SLIGHTLY moving the back of the tongue (it wouldbe like 1/4 of the real "GN" is you know what I mean). Don't say "Gn" per se; it will relax the tongue and put it back into place.

Hey, about the tongue, if you wat to mantain the bright ringing sound in you higher range, it is ok that your tongue and raise a bit, in fact it helps... For rock, the sound produced in this manner works wonders (David Coverdale, James Labrie)... What you Don't want is the tongue to become an excuse to tighten the jaw and cause constrictions ! Take note on that, and if that is what's going on, absolutely do what Oiselle says, it's great advice....

Otherwise it is cool that it is raised...now, you may want to control that on your mid notes and make it something gradual as you higher in order to help with having a consistent tone :D....

ah ok cheers.
Yeh its only on the higher notes... thats my main worry, the tension with it...
It does shake a bit, for example, like lifting a heavy weight, after a while when u feel like u cant hold it much longer, your arm starts straining....and although i dont strain lots, or i wudnt be able to sing like i do, i end up straining little bits here and there and then it builds up and i get tired...
i need to keep that tongue relaxed...but at the moment if i try and keep it relaxed, i cant hit the higher notes....but im sure if i work on it ill get it.

btw, i meant to say your arm starts shaking :P

On high notes before my break my notes shake as well. They flutter in the same matter that you arm would shake lifting heavy weights. Even though you just made that analogy, I had been thinking about that very same thing for awhile. My question is: The only way to combat the shakes on these notes is to continue to do a daily vocalizing routine with minimal tension and hope for the best?

altered: yeah, I guess so. I think alot of "muscular revelations" simply come with time, and there's not much point in trying to find a quick fix.

funnily enough...i had one of these revelations yesterday and still going today.... Im actually not straining 'at all'.... im hitting a C5 in chest voice with complete ease...and able to hold it until i run out of breath.....i have never ever been able to do that, and i dont know what im doing? but everything just seems so easy lol
its a miracle!
my voice is starting to feel so connected too with my headvoice sounding better and feeling different to use.... woo hoo
whatever im doing, i just gotta hope i get the same results all week. im gonna give it a break tomorrow though becos i have been practicing every day since last week.

That's great, Lee!

Just curious...are you sure you mean "chest voice"? I can only hit a C5 in head voice.

Well... i say its chest voice because its before my break. I break into headvoice on the C#5... i suppose some people call that difficult area just below the chest/head voice break middle voice, because most of the resonance is in the pharynx, but just to make it easier when im talking to people (not you guys who know Jaimes terms) i call everything below that breakpoint chest, becos it feels weighty, and then everything about head voice, and ive just got used to it.
but to be honest, saying that, with this breakthrough ive been having the last 2 days my C5 feels more like a blend of chest and head, and i think thats why its so much easier. Ive been trying to work on this blend for a long time, with bad results becos its either one of the other....but i think ive got it and thats why my voice feels more connected *crosses fingers*

Lee said:

But now ive realised that ive got to the stage where i dont need to think about it now, and when i forget about chest voice and head voice, and just try and hit the note without thinking 'i have to go into headvoice for this', i just automatically go into head voice but the tone is matched alot more with my chest voice tone.....
so im not longer trying to hit the note in head voice, im just trying to hit the note.....if you get what i mean?


That's what it's all about brother! You train your ass off, then when it's time for action you forget about it all. Yeah, I know exactly what you mean.

That's a great feeling when you realize you just sang the hell out of a difficult part and all you were thinking about was communicating the lyrics or emotion of the song...no technical stuff.

I suppose if you can ALWAYS have that feeling then you've really accomplished something! I'm not there yet, but it's something to strive for.

Ah, I understand now. :)

Well it turns out that break through only lasted 2 days :P
I took a day off on monday to give my voice a rest, then i started again yesterday and not only was the head voice thing not working, the strain on that tenor C was back again.
SO i was hoping that it would all be working today, but its even worse... and my voice is breaking alot on my top chest voice notes now....its just making this grating noise when im singing around there.

lol frustrating stuff

Im sure ill get whatever i was doing again....*prays*

Hey man... I think many of the of the issues that you've mention have to do with YOU thinking too much about the chest voice/head voice stuff.... remember it's all about:

- open throat (all the sensations Jaime talks about are helpful on this one)

- Support!!!!!!!!! HUGE POINT... those powerful high notes need firm support !! when you (unconsciously) use "helping muscles" (tightening the jaw, neck etc..) instead of focusing on your support (well, actually in time I think you will do it automatically) you end up straining and stuff (stuff includes: wobbly notes and inabilty to do powerful high notes)...

SO USE EXTRA SUPPORT (not to be confused with extra air, which will result in kinda the opposite)...

When instead of focusing on that switch between head voice and chest voice (which actually does not really exist as an isolated phenomenom) you focus on adding the necessary support (for me, the rocket visualization helped with this !!) that each note needs, it all feels the same in your throat !!


how does all of this connects to the tongue?? well it should not ! you should be able to lift your tongue and larynx (in a natural manner) WITHOUT tensing the larunx to maintain the rock sound!!


head voice or chest voice ?? who cares ! haha FULL voice buddy hahaha full voice !...


I also had issues with this stuff, and I mainly blame it on the head voice/chest voice thing !!... It is true that sound resonates more in the head in highs and more in the chest at the lows.... but it aint gonna click or break anywhere unless you loose the coordination between the note and the needed support .... OMG all this Ranting just come to the point out that:

- You should work your support
- You should see how it feels while doing sirens

hahahahaha peace :P

OMG so many typos XD sorryyy

Sorry, where I said "tensing the Larynx" it is actually "tensing up" ..... you can't tense a cartilage by itself XD!

Oh God help me!!! *attempts to struggle out from under the rubble of Xavier's typos and mistakes*

I'm only teasing. He's right, of course.


Lee, if it's any comfort at all, I have had that happen to me too many times to count. Really.

I remember once about two months ago I just had two days where I really HAD it. You know? Breath support, high notes, resonance... every thing. Then it all fell apart, and for the next six weeks, I was straining and pushing and generally sounding like rubbish.

It's only in the last two weeks that I've slowly been able to rediscover some of those techniques and placements that were helping me before.



But as I always tell myself, "You've done it once, you can get it back again!" So now I say that to you!

You've done it once, Lee. Just be patient, practice hard, and I know it'll all come back to you.

If you can lose it in three days, you can get it back with three days of practice (not neccesarily in a row :P).

Also first post, woot!

It's interesting to hear people talk about their high and low days (or even weeks). I too go through periods in which I feel either everything falls into place...or nothing does. It's quite a piss-off.

Two weeks ago, I also felt that my break (C5)was like a perfect hybrid between chest and head voice. My voice was actually a seemless instrument!! But then came back the reality of seperating chest and head sensations. Otherwise a C5 usually flutters back and forth between the two unless I hold it in head voice or force it into chest. It's a frustrating game.

I seriously want to find a good coach. Not someone who just sits and play a few scales on the piano (as someone once said on this board)...but someone who can point all the flaws in my technique.

thanks for the support guys, yeh im sure ill get there again lol

and altered, thats exactly what im on about... my voice had no break, i usually have that same problem with the C5 where (what i prefer to do) i struggle to hit in chest voice and then on the c sharp i go into head voice....and its very awkward singing back and forth that break, but the other day it just wasnt there, it was one whole voice and i was just singing the notes, not worrying about what voice it shud be in or where the break was...
dammit lol its one step forward and 2 steps back, becos now im doing worse than i usually do *singing practice at this very moment*....i think im just gonna rest my voice for a few days now, maybe try again on sunday.
Maybe its possible that the breakthrough i had requires alot more muscle strength and coordination that im ready for, so my chords just could be tired out from it now.

Oo and welcome Gaz :P

Ok just finished my practice, and i think i know what it could have been. Since i was trying to 'forget' everything and just get on with it, i was reverting back to the old way i used to sing.
Basically a few months back to get that sound placement in my head properly i let my tone become alot more nasal... and at first i didnt like the sound of my tone, but afterwards i prefered it and thats how i sing now...but since i havent been doing it long its not drilled into my automatic pilot yet, so becos i was trying to not think of stuff, i was letting myself sing how i used too, which soounds alot thicker, but the sound sits in my throat....so im hoping thats what the problems have been from.
Im still gonna give it a rest for a few days though to repair n e damage ive done.